Q&A: Greedy politicians perpetuate dynasty, says SM Krishna

Veteran  leader, S.M. Krishna, now in the BJP, rarely steps outside the bounds of propriety and good grace. In this free-wheeling exclusive with BHASKAR HEGDE however, the former chief minister didn't pull any punches when it came to the state's ruling dispensation’s move to field a third generation of political heirs. Mr Krishna didn't cavil at taking a swipe at his old friend Mallikarjun Kharge who has been facing a barrage of criticism over promoting his own son over other Congress aspirants. And in speaking openly for the first time about how he was shifted to Raj Bhavan in distant Mumbai at the behest of his arch rival H.D. Deve Gowda who called the shots in the Dharam Singh government, much as he does today, the man who transformed Bengaluru into India's Silicon Valley didn't hold back. Excerpts:

Bengaluru: In a clear signal that the former chief minister of Karnataka may be readying to take on a much more prominent role and reclaim the space he ceded in his old stomping grounds - the city of Bengaluru that he transformed into the IT capital of the country and his home base of Mandya - S.M.Krishna slammed the Congress and its coalition partner Janata Dal (S)' for its promotion of dynasty.  

With parliamentary polls less than three weeks away, and the BJP determined to grab a slice of the Cong-JD(S) base in the south, the former Congressman not only hit out at his old friends in Congress including Mallikarjun Kharge, but spoke of how he was forced into accepting the governorship of Maharashtra, and how the Dharam Singh government reversed his plans for Bengaluru while questioning Rahul Gandhi's credentials to lead the country as compared to PM Narendra Modi.  

Without taking names, Mr Krishna remarked: “Dynastic politics, now in full flow in some parties, is nothing but the expression of a feudal mentality". Strongly pitching for PM Modi's return to power, the former external affairs minister, in a free-wheeling interview with Deccan Chronicle, dismissed his old friend Mallikarjun Kharge's performance as Congress leader while making strong observations on Mr Kharge's love for his son which is causing discomfiture to fellow Congressmen in the Kalaburgi Lok Sabha seat.

On the performance of the coalition government, he asked, “Where is governance? There is a CM and Deputy CM no doubt. That's it. No vision, no strategy. No objectives. Not even a Common Minimum Programme which could be the reference point for the coalition. The least that they could have worked out was a CMP. All of them want to join together and their objective is to share the spoils of office. That's  the CMP to put it bluntly. Zero development is the end result. Consider the potential of Bengaluru. There is unlimited potential. Even today, the world looks at India through the prism of Bengaluru. Dr Manmohan Singh had told me this on a couple of occasions. But what have they done?”

Asked about his tenure as CM from 1999-2004 when he set in motion the transformation of Bengaluru into the Silicon Valley of the country, he replied, “It was by design that I was sent out of Karnataka (after the 2004 Assembly polls). They (Congress high command) need not have sent me out. I could have been opposition leader.  Out of deference to Soniaji, I went (as Maharashtra governor). As soon as I left, they wanted to sabotage my plans for Bengaluru.  Those who succeeded me (Dharam Singh government), wanted to accrue other benefits for themselves. They did not make use of the plan I prepared. As a result, the city  degenerated, deteriorated. In 2004 they had a grievance against me and they wanted to undo my developmental model. They succeeded."

On whether the coalition government would survive after Parliament elections, he said, “Mr Modi will come back to power and his return will have an impact on various states including Karnataka.”

Two weeks back, you had been to Mandya and gave a call to Congress leaders to join BJP. Has anything happened on that front?
Yes I did. I think there is a groundswell of support from my fans and loyalists. In terms of numbers, they matter a lot in the election.

Whenever elections come, people talk about caste. But you as an individual seem to have given less weightage to caste in your personal life. Why?
By nature, I am like that. My upbringing in the Ramakrishna Mission had a huge positive impact in shaping my personality. I studied there and I imbibed the culture. I have no regrets about my identity. I would like to be identified by everyone and have a sense of belonging with everyone that I come across.

Leaders of your age still wear caste on their sleeve, whip up emotions on caste lines during elections and swing votes. But many of your supporters feel you have not taken care of their interests on these lines.
They (supporters) might have a legitimate grouse as other leaders consciously make a pitch on these lines (caste). I tried to inculcate a feeling among my followers that everybody belongs to us. Caste is not the be all and end all.

While you prefer to follow certain principles, morals and  lofty ideals, your opponents do the opposite and in the process, you and your followers inevitably lose out in electoral politics.
Yes, you have a point. They (opponents) exploit  caste and its emotional content to reap benefits. I don’t deny that. That’s been happening for so many years. Regardless of the ups and downs in public life, if that is the price one has to pay, I am willing to pay that. That’s a matter of conviction. Great personalities like Ramakrishna Paramahamsa, Swami Vivekananda and Kuvempu had an enormous impact on me. So, I may not compromise on it.

Now coming to the mundane politics of Mandya, how do you assess the situation after the Congress handed over the seat to JD (S)?
(ha-ha) The big question is: how far they will be able to transfer votes to the candidate of the coalition partner(JD-S)? In the recent assembly elections, they fought bitterly and the bitterness is palpable at the booth level and in villages. The BJP does not have a very strong base there but we are trying to build the party.

In the past, the BJP did try to build the party base. Still leaders could not  succeed. Why?
Well, a concentrated and sustained effort was not made. If there is focused attention, it can be achieved with the help of Modiji’s image. Leaders like C.T. Ravi and R. Ashok can take a lead. Considering the image of Modiji, the BJP can make reasonable inroads.

But Mr Modi could not make an impact outside the Hindi heartland..
If at all any Hindi speaking leader can make a dent down south, it is Mr Modi. Because of the performance and image that he built through his programmes, he has and will continue to find traction. The other reason could be that Mr Modi speaks in Hindi. I hope that when he  comes down  south,  he speaks in English or   in both English and Hindi. That will go a long way in creating a feeling of belonging among people.

What is the role you are going to play in this election? Will you contest?
No, I will not contest. I have to respect my age. I have a limited role in this election. In a few constituencies where I might matter and for some candidates to whom I could prove useful, I will campaign.

One of your old colleagues, M. Mallikarjunn Kharge was the Congress leader in the Lok Sabha. How do you rate his performance?
I have not closely followed him. Yet, I can say he was severely handicapped when pitched against a super orator like Modi. He could not overcome that handicap.

As an observer of state politics, particularly the performance of the coalition government and the fight within, one of the recent issues to surface is the accusation against Mr Kharge that he pushed for his son Priyank too hard.
In a situation like this, one should have sacrificed one`s son’s interests and supported others. That would have sent out a positive message to the party and the region. Disillusionment is bound to happen when something like this happens and the inevitable conclusion that people would draw is: he tried to promote his son at the cost of others.

Why did you take a principled stand that you would not promote your daughters in politics?
They were not interested. They are involved in their families. That is their first priority. As entrepreneurs they are doing something. I want them to flourish in their chosen field. I will not prevent them if at all they want to come to politics. But I will not promote them.

In recent weeks, more than one member of one prominent  family is contesting in so many seats. Has the grammar of dynastic politics changed?
In plain terms, that’s feudalistic. Too many (of one family in the fray) will irritate the people. Each one of us have our own perception. Everybody is entitled to seek political office. No bar on it. But, there should be  discipline. If someone’s agenda is to promote his own children, grandchildren and relatives, there is nothing one can do. Except that the people and voters will have to be astute, drive home a message against greedy politicians who perpetuate dynasty.

You were in the Congress party for a long time. How do you view incumbent AICC president Rahul Gandhi’s growth?
Well, to become the Prime Minister of this big and diverse country, one needs a lot of experience in administration and public life. I am reluctant to make a comparison. There are two extremes. A middle aged person in a hurry to become something is pitted against a tested and proven leader who is the man of the moment.

Mr Gandhi has a legacy. In fact, the Congress party says it was he who anchored the victory in the recent Assembly polls in three north Indian states.
There was tremendous anti-incumbency in those three states. The victory cannot be attributed to a certain individual. The state leaders also matter and I know many of them very well. I have worked with them in the past.

Four months back, the impression was that the Mahaghatbandhan would beat  Team Modi. Now, it looks like the Mahaghatbandhan is on a sticky wicket. Moreover, the other parties do not seem to trust the Congress.
They don’t trust the Congress and its leadership.  They suspect that they may not reach the desired goal if they go with the Congress party. The SP and BSP wanted to give the Congress only 2 seats in UP, this shows the plight of the Congress in the largest state.

Would you say the Mahaghatbandhan is a non-starter?
Where is the ghatbandhan? Why do you glorify a group by using the word ‘Mahaghatabandhan?’